@GÄ…ska said in Random thought of the day:
I don't think so, no. I've never seen anyone who's verifiably, genuinely racist say that he's just saying racist things ironically.
hi, i am a jewish person who used to hang out on neo-nazi websites because i was in a very dark place and wanted to go places where people would hate me. i have several friends who did the same thing. i think i am an expert on this topic and pretty unbiased.
it's weird to me that when someone says "i believe this totally reprehensible thing," (usually something about race, sex, or gender) bystanders say:
- well, they obviously don't truly believe that
- but if they did, it would be their right to say it
- and who are you to criticize them for it?
it's not like people say "maybe they don't truly believe that" when someone, say, promotes the Spring framework. it seems to be limited to really awful views that are widely held in secret.
guys who are being ironically racist usually don't have a subtle or satirical edge. basically their schtick is to say the same things unironic racists believe. it's usually very, very, very transparent! there's usually no joke and they usually nakedly appeal to lies that are widely believed by racists, in a way that implies those lies are true.
they have a strong incentive to say that the racism is ironic, because they would not be treated kindly if they actually held those views. if you respond by trying to refute those views (or in general in a way that implies the views aren't true) they tend to take hazy defensive stances that "i don't believe it, but i bet you can't prove me wrong" or try to call you smelly or say you're no fun. in other words, they react like the thing they said is embarrassing but they still want to defend it.
i get that some of these people may have tone-deaf imitators who don't see themselves as racists, and i agree that 4chan culture encourages this kind of thing, but i really see this as the minority. when ironic racism is directed at you, it doesn't feel ironic, and ironic racists tend to project tons of obvious signs that they actually want other people to believe their racism
imho the only reason people continue to say they can't tell racism is serious is because there is practically no ironic racism, but people continue to insist ironic racism exists online. so people who want to give others the benefit of the doubt assume they just can't see the differentiators.
analogy: suppose you live in australia and your goal is to find a vampire bat. you can check as many bats as you want, but you won't find one because they don't live in Australia. that doesn't mean you should change the definition of "vampire bat" to include fruit bats with particularly large teeth.
it also doesn't mean that the vampire-ness of a bat is an ephemeral characteristic that's only visible to experienced batfinders. if you found a real vampire bat it would be super obvious. but when someoen acts as if someone who says racist things needs to be "verifiably, genuinely racist" they're acting as if it's ephemeral and you just can't tell-- as if just defending racist ideas using lies believed by racists isn't sufficient evidence
i would encourage people who say they can't tell ironic and unironic racism apart to instead just say "if i can't tell it's ironic, it's probably unironic." imho you need to do tons of special pleading and stuff to seriously defend the idea that it's secretly ironic. having people misinterpret your racist joke as actual racism is an occupational hazard of being a person who tells racist jokes -- it's your fault if you say "i hate jews" and you get banned for hating jews