Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?
-
Proposal would give EU power to boot tech giants out of European market
Companies could be broken up or forced to sell off European operations.
Someone tell me how to feel about this, please.
-
@Benjamin-Hall Honestly? With companies like Google being stuffed with H1Bs and it being impossible to reach anybody when something goes wrong, the smaller they are and the less they control, the better.
-
@Zenith said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
@Benjamin-Hall Honestly? With companies like Google being stuffed with H1Bs and it being impossible to reach anybody when something goes wrong, the smaller they are and the less they control, the better.
I both agree and disagree. I don't like the big tech companies and their octopus-like reach. But the thought of allowing an international body known for being out of touch with the normal people to have fine-grained control either....I can't see that it's any better.
-
@Benjamin-Hall said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
But the thought of allowing an international body known for being out of touch with the normal people to have fine-grained control either....I can't see that it's any better.
Don't get me wrong, the EU and its unelected councils are a clusterfuck. I just hope they're so paralyzed by stupidity and infighting that they suffocate the tech companies as a side effect of that incompetence.
-
@Zenith so a "can they both lose" scenario?
-
Seems like the EU is looking to get on par with the US.
-
@Benjamin-Hall said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
Proposal would give EU power to boot tech giants out of European market
Companies could be broken up or forced to sell off European operations.
Someone tell me how to feel about this, please.
It's bad.
The problem with an international body like this is that they'll tend to try to enforce European law on the entire operation, and I have no way of opposing European laws I disagree with.
Whereas when the US government enforces American law on foreign companies throughout their entire operation, I have the ability to vote for better politicans who will write better laws.
I recognize that there's two problems with that view.
- I personally live in a one party state with rampant election fraud, so my ability to select better politicans is a laughable joke.
- More relevantly, if I were a European, I would probably feel exactly the opposite way.
There's a very fine line between a jurisdiction adding too much extra jurisdiction-specific rules and allowing the other jurisdiction to imperialize you with their shitty laws.
We all get why this is a problem when China does this. The only reason that this is less of a problem when Europe does it is that Europe is currently less bad than China.
-
@Benjamin-Hall said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
Proposal would give EU power to boot tech giants out of European market
Companies could be broken up or forced to sell off European operations.
Someone tell me how to feel about this, please.
At least it's interesting that this arrives as the US is moving to do the same against two of the few non-US-based social networks.
-
@PleegWat Yeah. Hence some of my internal conflict. I don't like it when anyone does it, but I recognize that it seems to be SOP. But I also strongly dislike the big tech companies and really don't like it when China uses them as spyware (as seems to be the case with Tik-Tok. I hope I'd feel the same if the US was using Google et al as spyware.
Again, can't they all lose?
-
@Zenith said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
@Benjamin-Hall Honestly? With companies like Google being stuffed with H1Bs and it being impossible to reach anybody when something goes wrong, the smaller they are and the less they control, the better.
I was recently talking with my friends the Taylers about various stuff, and the subject of customer service at tech companies came up. Sandra mentioned how awful it was at Amazon. This left me a bit confused, and I pointed out that I could go on their site, hit a button, and get a phone call from them within half an hour. From my point of view, their customer service is world-class!
She explained that she was talking about it from the content creator side, that trying to reach someone in the Kindle department who can help authors with problems they're having is virtually impossible, which I conceded I had no experience with. Seems odd though, that they can do such a stellar job helping out the massive worldwide audience that is Amazon customers, but fall flat on their face when dealing with the much, much smaller audience that is authors.
-
This post is deleted!
-
@Benjamin-Hall said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
I hope I'd feel the same if the US was using Google et al as spyware.
I know years ago I read about a case where the US justice department demanded data which MS Ireland had stored on a server in Ireland, and IIRC the US judge decided MS should turn up the requested information.
to look up details though.
-
@PleegWat said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
@Benjamin-Hall said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
I hope I'd feel the same if the US was using Google et al as spyware.
I know years ago I read about a case where the US justice department demanded data which MS Ireland had stored on a server in Ireland, and IIRC the US judge decided MS should turn up the requested information.
to look up details though.Oh absolutely. That's why I'm pretty sure it's SOP right now. Part of why I'm not really pissed about this, more just meh.
-
@Mason_Wheeler said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
She explained that she was talking about it from the content creator side, that trying to reach someone in the Kindle department who can help authors with problems they're having is virtually impossible, which I conceded I had no experience with. Seems odd though, that they can do such a stellar job helping out the massive worldwide audience that is Amazon customers, but fall flat on their face when dealing with the much, much smaller audience that is authors.
It's the same for Amazon Marketplace sellers. You can't reach a person and appeals (when they give away your money despite tracking showing not just delivered but signed for) are automatically closed by robots within minutes. They don't care about authors or merchants because they feel they're a dime a dozen, even though it's actually consumers that are a dime a dozen. Not just my experience either, I know a publishing executive that hates their guts for how difficult it is to work through them.
-
@Mason_Wheeler said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
Seems odd though, that they can do such a stellar job helping out the massive worldwide audience that is Amazon customers, but fall flat on their face when dealing with the much, much smaller audience that is authors.
Customers can chargeback. Authors can't. Always follow the money.
-
@GuyWhoKilledBear said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
I personally live in a one party state with rampant election fraud, so myAny voter’s ability to select better politicans is a laughable joke.
FTFY.
-
@hungrier I suspected so but it was hard to tell after other people said that 100% seriously in recent time.
-
@GuyWhoKilledBear said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
and I have no way of opposing European laws I disagree with.
Welcome to the club!
That is exactly why both the "Safe Harbor" and "EU-US privacy shield" agreements were voided by the ECJ. European data protection laws demand certain levels of data protection that the US does not provide, which technically require Facebook et al. to stop exporting EU customer data to the US. Which was solved by a political sleight of hand with these agreements that simply said the data is safe in the US, while the opposite is obviously true. The US can access said data and European citizens neither get informed about that nor do they have any standing to sue against it.
When there's a conflict where EU laws forbid a company to hand over data on EU servers to the US, whereas US laws say that US companies (even if it's EU subsidies) hand over whatever they demand, the US political stance (as was demonstrated in the MS case mentioned above) is "we don't care, hand it over." That is of course your right, you can make your own laws however you want. It is, however, absolutely ridiculous for the EU to accept that situation and even declare the US a "safe harbor". The EU should enforce its laws just as well as the US does, and if that creates a situation where a US company cannot do business without breaking either US law or EU law, then either they should cease doing business or get the politicians back to the drawing board and actually negotiate some workable agreements. Instead, the EU had just let the US do whatever it wants.
And also has let Facebook break all their data protection laws willy-nilly.@Benjamin-Hall said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
I hope I'd feel the same if the US was using Google et al as spyware.
Would? They most certainly do.
Again, can't they all lose?
I'd be totally fine with the US banning TikTok and the EU banning Facebook. Win-win.
On a semi-related note:
Facebook Says it Will Stop Operating in Europe If Regulators Don’t Back Down
European regulators are cracking down on Facebook's ability to transfer data across the Atlantic. Now the tech giant is threatening to pull its services from more than 400 million European users.
Oh, so now they're [not] threatening to "pull out of Europe" if the laws are actually going to be enforced? Don't let the door hit you on your way out.
Also, I'm sure the IRS would be interested in a few billion in taxes if you stop using the Ireland tax avoidance scheme.
-
@GuyWhoKilledBear said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
This thread largely consists of people who live in America
So this is a USA only thread? Don't you have enough of those already?
-
@Luhmann said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
@GuyWhoKilledBear said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
This thread largely consists of people who live in America
So this is a USA only thread? Don't you have enough of those already?
I'm interested in what you think "largely" means.
-
@GuyWhoKilledBear said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
@Luhmann said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
@GuyWhoKilledBear said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
This thread largely consists of people who live in America
So this is a USA only thread? Don't you have enough of those already?
I'm interested in what you think "largely" means.
-
@GuyWhoKilledBear said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
the EU's reputation for heavy-handedness and unaccountability
It is most certainly true that the EU is not ultimately accountable to US voters. Conversely, the US is not ultimately accountable to EU voters. (Talking about the EU is in many ways like talking about the Feds; the degree of accountability in both cases is… imperfect, but perhaps better than some of the alternatives.)
-
@topspin said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
@GuyWhoKilledBear said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
and I have no way of opposing European laws I disagree with.
Welcome to the club!
That is exactly why both the "Safe Harbor" and "EU-US privacy shield" agreements were voided by the ECJ. European data protection laws demand certain levels of data protection that the US does not provide, which technically require Facebook et al. to stop exporting EU customer data to the US. Which was solved by a political sleight of hand with these agreements that simply said the data is safe in the US, while the opposite is obviously true. The US can access said data and European citizens neither get informed about that nor do they have any standing to sue against it.
When there's a conflict where EU laws forbid a company to hand over data on EU servers to the US, whereas US laws say that US companies (even if it's EU subsidies) hand over whatever they demand, the US political stance (as was demonstrated in the MS case mentioned above) is "we don't care, hand it over." That is of course your right, you can make your own laws however you want. It is, however, absolutely ridiculous for the EU to accept that situation and even declare the US a "safe harbor". The EU should enforce its laws just as well as the US does, and if that creates a situation where a US company cannot do business without breaking either US law or EU law, then either they should cease doing business or get the politicians back to the drawing board and actually negotiate some workable agreements. Instead, the EU had just let the US do whatever it wants.
And also has let Facebook break all their data protection laws willy-nilly.@Benjamin-Hall said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
I hope I'd feel the same if the US was using Google et al as spyware.
Would? They most certainly do.
Again, can't they all lose?
I'd be totally fine with the US banning TikTok and the EU banning Facebook. Win-win.
On a semi-related note:
Facebook Says it Will Stop Operating in Europe If Regulators Don’t Back Down
European regulators are cracking down on Facebook's ability to transfer data across the Atlantic. Now the tech giant is threatening to pull its services from more than 400 million European users.
Oh, so now they're [not] threatening to "pull out of Europe" if the laws are actually going to be enforced? Don't let the door hit you on your way out.
Also, I'm sure the IRS would be interested in a few billion in taxes if you stop using the Ireland tax avoidance scheme.I fail to see a downside if they stop operating there. I'd love for social media to die in a fire anyway, as it has changed our society for the worse.
-
@Zenith I personally appreciate the EU and its institutions and I find claims of "bureaucracy" and "unelectedness" to be usually exaggerated.
Except the cookie law, they messed that one up.
-
This post is deleted!
-
@anonymous234 said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
Except the cookie law, they messed that one up.
Did they mandate walnuts in the chocolate chip cookies? Because that's just evil.
-
@Benjamin-Hall said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
@anonymous234 said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
Except the cookie law, they messed that one up.
Did they mandate walnuts in the chocolate chip cookies? Because that's just evil.
That is a fucking abomination
.
-
@HardwareGeek said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
@GuyWhoKilledBear said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
@Luhmann said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
@GuyWhoKilledBear said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
This thread largely consists of people who live in America
So this is a USA only thread? Don't you have enough of those already?
I'm interested in what you think "largely" means.
Exhibit 1: People who live in America
-
@Benjamin-Hall said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
Did they mandate walnuts in the chocolate chip cookies? Because that's just evil.
MMMmmmm. Walnuts…
-
@Benjamin-Hall said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
@anonymous234 said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
Except the cookie law, they messed that one up.
Did they mandate walnuts in the chocolate chip cookies? Because that's just evil.
No, but the banana chocolate chip cookies must not exceed maximum curvature.
-
It's entirely reasonable for companies which want to sell or provide services to people in [jurisdiction X] to be expected to follow the laws of [jurisdiction X], and that includes competition law. And if they don't, and hide under the cover of being based abroad, then you need to be able to ban them from your market.
The US already does this. Why should US-based companies expect that they can get away without doing so in places where they are the foreign entity?
The EU is far from perfect (look at the cookie law ...) but it's far more accountable to the people of EU member states than the US is. So I totally support this (and a UK equivalent).
-
@Benjamin-Hall said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
@anonymous234 said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
Except the cookie law, they messed that one up.
Did they mandate walnuts in the chocolate chip cookies? Because that's just evil.
Better walnuts than raisins
-
@hungrier said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
raisins
OMG, what's with all talking about disgusting stuff lately?
-
@hungrier said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
Better walnuts than raisins
Those are both fine. It's peanuts that I don't like at all. (No allergy. Just don't like the taste.)
-
@hungrier said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
Better walnuts than raisins
How dare you even mention them in one sentence. Walnuts improve almost everything they're added to. Raisins instantly make everything inedible.
-
@dkf said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
It's peanuts that I don't like at all.
I eat peanut-flavored anything, no matter how disgusting it is.
-
@hungrier said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
@Benjamin-Hall said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
@anonymous234 said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
Except the cookie law, they messed that one up.
Did they mandate walnuts in the chocolate chip cookies? Because that's just evil.
Better walnuts than raisins
I like both walnuts and raisins but they are not allowed anywhere near my chocolate.
-
@dfdub said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
@hungrier said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
Better walnuts than raisins
How dare you even mention them in one sentence. Walnuts improve almost everything they're added to. Raisins instantly make everything inedible.
No. Just no. Walnuts are evil, raisins are ok. Not great in most things, but ok.
-
@Benjamin-Hall said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
@dfdub said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
@hungrier said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
Better walnuts than raisins
How dare you even mention them in one sentence. Walnuts improve almost everything they're added to. Raisins instantly make everything inedible.
No. Just no. Walnuts are evil, raisins are ok. Not great in most things, but ok.
That's crazy talk.
-
@MrL said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
That's crazy talk.
No, this is crazy talk:
Charles Manson's Epic Question – 00:12
— crusher8576
-
@Karla said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
they are not allowed anywhere near my chocolate
but... but... if not walnuts and raisins, what do you put in your chocolate to make it edible?
-
Do you feel blame? Are you mad? Uh, do you feel like wolf kabob Roth vantage? Gefrannis booj pooch boo jujube; bear-ramage. Jigiji geeji geeja geeble. I like raisins. Begep flagaggle vaggle veditch-waggle bagga?
Yep, crazy
-
@robo2 said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
@Karla said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
they are not allowed anywhere near my chocolate
but... but... if not walnuts and raisins, what do you put in your chocolate to make it edible?
Methamphetamine!
-
@Gąska said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
@HardwareGeek said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
@GuyWhoKilledBear said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
@Luhmann said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
@GuyWhoKilledBear said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
This thread largely consists of people who live in America
So this is a USA only thread? Don't you have enough of those already?
I'm interested in what you think "largely" means.
Exhibit 1: People who live in America
-
@hungrier said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
@Benjamin-Hall said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
@anonymous234 said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
Except the cookie law, they messed that one up.
Did they mandate walnuts in the chocolate chip cookies? Because that's just evil.
Better walnuts than raisins
Raisins in oatmeal:
(In fact, I'm eating that for breakfast at this moment.)
Raisins in cinnamon-raisin bread: (Just don't let them burn.)
Raisins in carrot salad:
Raisins in oatmeal cookies: eh
Raisins in chocolate chip cookies:
Best raisins I've ever had in my life, and probably ever will have: Sun-dried on a neglected vine in my parents' back yard, picked and eaten straight from the vine.
Edit: Raisins in biryani:
-
@HardwareGeek said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
Raisins in carrot salad
I can kinda understand the rest, even though I probably wouldn't eat them if I had the choice. but this one does not sound appealing to me. And you forgot Indian curries in the list of foods where raisins are sometimes tolerable in small amounts.
-
@dfdub said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
@HardwareGeek said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
Raisins in carrot salad
I can kinda understand the rest, even though I probably wouldn't eat them if I had the choice. but this one does not sound appealing to me.
Same. Carrots in a salad? WTF, man?
-
@dfdub said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
And you forgot Indian curries in the list of foods where raisins are sometimes tolerable in small amounts.
That implies that Indian curries are tolerable in any amount, which is not the case.
-
@hungrier said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
Do you feel blame? Are you mad? Uh, do you feel like wolf kabob Roth vantage? Gefrannis booj pooch boo jujube; bear-ramage. Jigiji geeji geeja geeble. I like raisins. Begep flagaggle vaggle veditch-waggle bagga?
Yep, crazy
I nearly missed that. Well played, sir.
-
@error said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
@robo2 said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
@Karla said in Another GDPR? Electric googleoo?:
they are not allowed anywhere near my chocolate
but... but... if not walnuts and raisins, what do you put in your chocolate to make it edible?
Methamphetamine!
This is fake. The company was founded in 1999 and obviously this never existed. (Which is not to say the Nazis didn’t use drugs)
But I know,
.
